Also, I've been thinking about the applicability of LotRO content here for a while now. By definition, of course, any location/character/significant object from the game can belong here as an article. But as you can see here: , there are over 86,000 content articles at the Lotro Wiki, and there's no reason for us to have near-duplicate articles for each item, nor would it be feasible. Do you think there's some kind of parameters we could set for LotRO content here for the sake of organization? Obviously depictions of canon material belongs, but perhaps also major locations and characters that directly tie in to the main quests? Just some thoughts.
Have a good evening, --Bitterhand (talk) 03:07, March 26, 2019 (UTC)
why you removed the siblings part of berelach?
for gods sake the realm is GONDOR isn't it?
oh ok but i thought it was important to fill the entries that we surely know (they are actually unknown but ok)
Hi! My name is Playsonic2, and I’m the Fandom Wiki Manager for The Lord of the Rings Wiki. I am here to help the community and be a liaison to full-time Fandom staff. If you ever have a question or issue relating to the wiki, editing, etc., please contact me on my talk page. See you! ~Playsonic2 14:33, May 20, 2019 (UTC)
Hi HiddenVale, how are you?
Well, as you may have noticed with the new change of our Community Org, our team will be highly focused on building a closer relationships with our communities, admins and users than before. As one of the Community Managers, I will be together with our Wiki Manager Playsonic2 to fully support this wiki, help you and other admins solve any issues/concerns on this wiki, partnership with you guys for any exciting relevant projects, and make this wiki more attractive and successful.
I have seen his introduction here so I wanted to do it too adding more information for you :D
Long in short - we are here to fully support any needs you may have to make this community keep growing successfully. If you and other admins need any help, feel free to directly contact Playsonic2 or me any time. We will be always in touch!
And now? I would like to know more about the community, if you have any important request for us, any concern or what are your expectations for the new TV series.
Of course! I'll continue to work on overall cohesiveness as I'm able. I'll likely scale back my edit volume for the next couple of weeks while I finish a class, but it shouldn't be anything drastic.
You may want to delete this: () category that I made before realizing you had already made one titled simply "Images of Wights". Also, though it's obviously low on the proverbial priorities list, I've marked quite a few superfluous and duplicate images for deletion (), which might help to clear up some disorganization.
Additionally, what do you think about deleting the articles here and possibly making a page listing the titles instead: ()? Personally I don't see much point in having a separate article for each scene, and we'd eventually have to add scenes for the previous two films to be consistent.
Thanks, --Bitterhand (talk) 17:48, June 5, 2019 (UTC)
yeah but the pictures from the movie were removed as well as the portrayal adaptation
Is there any mention in the Book of Lost Tales of Gilim having any allegiance to Morgoth? I don't have that book but I have the re-edited version of Beren and Luthien and Gilim is briefly mentioned there, but there is nothing to indicate that he is in league with Morgoth Bauglir.This is where I found him mentioned: "nor did she forget the chain Angainu that Aulë and Tulkas made or the neck of Gilim the giant". Giants were indead dangerous creatures, but there is no recorded version of them being allied with either one of the Dark Powers, as far as I know. I read the Silmarillion and Unfinished Tales but I found no mention of Giants serving evil overlords. Sure, they are used by the Goblin faction in BFME2 and the Angmar faction in the expansion pack ROTWK, but that's non-canon. So is Gilim ever counted by J.R.R. Tolkien himself or by his son Christopher among the servants/allies of Morgoth?Alex of Star Wars (talk) 12:15, June 9, 2019 (UTC)
I was just wondering if you could enable discussion on the LOTR wiki? I will be really grateful and believe me we would really have a good number of users using the Dboard. So pls let me know if that's possible.
- Hey HiddenVale, I saw your question on Slack and that you had requested Discussions be enabled. To speed things up a bit I went ahead and enabled it. You can find it now on https://lotr.fandom.com/. - Brandon Rhea(talk) 00:48, June 23, 2019 (UTC)
- Oh. Splendid, thank you! HiddenVale - TalkPage 00:51, June 23, 2019 (UTC)
I would also like to propose myself for moderatorship on the Dboard. I have experience with discussion rules n guidelines and I'm already moderating like three wikis. So it will be good if you grant my request. And thanks for enabling the discussion. Any idea why it has not popped in the fandom app yet?
- Ah it's okay. I understand I'm new here but not new to moderatorship. But anyways, hope you will grant my request in the upcoming days. I will be contributing to discussion and try to attract users there. And I guess, the staffs can enable the discussion on apps too, right? May be you could ask them for it. Thanks
- NVM, discussion has been enabled on app as well.
Great! I think that has a lot of potential to be a positive component of the wiki, and I'll certainly be active there. If you feel the need for one, I'll be happy to be a discussion moderator to help enforce the rules.
It might be prudent to add some additional rules depending on how it goes, but we'll have to play it by ear, obviously.
Thanks, and have a great evening!
--Bitterhand (talk) 01:51, June 23, 2019 (UTC)
Just wanted to get your opinion on some potential discussion rules (this came around faster than I anticipated). Could/should we ban quasi-irrelevant posts (currently those asking for favorite characters)? They're harmless, I suppose, but in one sense lower the general quality of material here. At the same time, I don't want to be legalistic with other users, but my impression is that it detracts from our purpose of being a serious Tolkien-centered encyclopedia and pulls more towards a fan-fic realm. (I've watched the Wookiepedia discussions go from a rather impressive center of news and analysis to a steady stream of memes, "who's the most powerful" polls and silly questions, and would prefer we avoid the same if possible.)
Or perhaps I'm overreacting; maybe that's just what the discussions are intended to be. But in any case just wanted to get your take before I added anything to the guidelines.
Thanks, and have a good evening.
--Bitterhand (talk) 01:24, June 26, 2019 (UTC)
I went ahead and updated the guidelines over on Discussions per what we talked about; obviously, feel free to amend what I added if needed. I'll be on the lookout for other types of posts that deserve to be listed, but I think that should do for now.
--Bitterhand (talk) 03:11, June 26, 2019 (UTC)
Sounds good; I’m about to turn in for the night, so I’ll email you as soon as I get a chance tomorrow. Thanks!
--Bitterhand (talk) 03:00, June 28, 2019 (UTC)
Hey Hiddenvale, I'm here just to let you guys know that the discussion has been enabled just right now. We don't even have enough contributors there so don't you guys think it's too early to set up strict guidelines right now? It's just the beginning of the Dboard and I can see more deleted posts than any discussion post. I'm not saying you guys are wrong but there are different types of users, some like to post memes, some have poll interests while some like to have in-depth discussion so I guess as the discussion has just began right now we should allow all types of contributions. Also, wookepedia got a revival cuz there were more number of deleted posts than the discussion posts and that's why the staffs took that measure. It's just a thought, let me know what you think of it.
Hello I'm Ran Fa Li 132 I'm in LOTR wikia... I'd like to apply for mod.. Consider this when there is a need for mods.. As bitter hand is the only mod there
And u asked how i came across this That's very simple I have been following this LOTR wikia for ages.. And I'm new to editing Started in HPW some time ago.. Newt strike the new GDM told me that the Dboard for LOTR is available now.. Thx for him..
It just occurred to me that the line between "who is better" posts (not allowed) and "who's your favorite" (currently allowed) posts in Discussions can actually be quite fine, as seen in the poll titled "Saruman or Sauron". What do you think the best solution might be? Personally, if I were the dictator of my own message board, I'd probably ban both, but I don't believe that's likely to be best here.
--Bitterhand (talk) 02:25, July 2, 2019 (UTC)
What do you think about deleting Legolas' Mirkwood bow, Gimli's battle axe, and Sam's Barrow-blade, for the same reason we don't have articles for "Faramir's sword"? Each are only mentioned a couple of times in The Fellowship of the Ring, and are not capitalized. I'm not sure if Gimli's Walking Axe should stay or not based on it being nominally unique to the films.
Also, do you have any objections if I start merging the articles here, or would some of these need more deliberation? It only occurred to me recently that non-admins can merge articles by redirecting/moving text if needed.
--Bitterhand (talk) 17:14, July 8, 2019 (UTC)
Just wanted to mention a couple of things that may not be high on the priorities list, but might merit a look.
Firstly, the "Forum" link on the dropdown from "Other" now directs to the new Discussion board, instead of the older Forum:Index. If there's anywhere that links to the old forum, I'm not aware of it. I wonder if there is any need now for the "Fellowship" forum, as it appears to serve the same purpose as the new Discussions, and it seems unlikely anyone will find/use it at this point. Depending on how we want to use the Discussions, I think we could potentially direct users to the Council for troubleshooting/wiki-based issues from the actual Discussions or clarify that Discussions is available for all questions.
Also, I believe we briefly discussed this a while back, but what do you think the process might should be for selecting new featured articles/pictures? I think it'd be beneficial to update our current selection sometime in the near future and establish a methodology for periodically updating as needed after that, and I'll be happy to help with it however the best way ends up being.
--Bitterhand (talk) 16:11, July 12, 2019 (UTC)
In most of the other wikis I've looked at, there appears to be a simple nomination/vote system, and the admin will then implement the winners. Wookiepedia, I'm sure due to its massive size and traffic, has a separate group of admin just to maintain the featured article system, and meets monthly to update it. Obviously there's no need for us to change the articles that frequently, and considering the number of nominations to the featured picture article, I'd propose something along the lines of this:
Leave a place open (or start a Discussion thread) for users to nominate articles if they wish, but primarily work off of joint admin analysis, with a tentative plan to review the current articles every six months or so. If it's you and I and/or the other admin, I imagine we could make do with simple agreement/discussion in lieu of straight-up voting. And if any major developments come out (Amazon series content, for instance) between periods, I'd assume that would be a valid impetus to add/subtract a few current articles as needed.
Anyway, those are just my thoughts; feel free to let me know if I can help with anything.
--Bitterhand (talk) 02:02, July 13, 2019 (UTC)
I went ahead and created new portals for the scenes from the Lord of the Rings film trilogy, so if all is done correctly I suppose we can delete the separate scene articles we discussed previously. And by the way, shouldn't the above link be titled "The Lord of the Rings film trilogy"? It appears that the current page was created by Mayooresan; a mistake seems likely given the grammar at their page. If so, I can move the info back to the original title, which is now a redirect.
Also, I just noticed that the "Forum" link to the right side of Recent Activity, in the "Community Messages" box, still directs to the deleted Forum:Index.
Have a good afternoon,
--Bitterhand (talk) 17:51, July 29, 2019 (UTC)
Hi HiddenVale, Thank you for the welcome note you gave me! I had a question. Is there any way to save a page that you are creating without publishing it so you can come back to work on it later? Hannon allen and God bless! -ArwenUdomiel (talk) 19:31, August 1, 2019 (UTC)
RE: New template and LOTR categories
I actually had in mind just what you mentioned with regard to clarification, specifically site visitors less familiar with Middle-earth; I guess I was more in the mindset of being organizationally accurate than of common sense. I certainly don't have a problem with leaving the template off those articles, so of course feel free to delete it.
Also, I meant to mention earlier that I don't see much point in having both of these categories:  and , since the latter will by definition include all the articles in the former. I think the major/minor character distinction is good, but having two categories that largely overlap doesn't seem to be of much help. Would one of those be a legitimate candidate for deletion?
Have a good evening, and sorry about any trouble.
--Bitterhand (talk) 01:33, August 4, 2019 (UTC)
As an appendix to the above question, what would you say constitutes a character being in that category; would a single mention or appearance sort that character into "Minor", and longer appearances into "Major"?
Also, as a brief note, do you think we can/should disallow "Who's your favorite" polls at this point in regard to the Discussions, or hold off for now? They really don't foster any discussion, and I think technically the Guidelines would be more consistent to exclude them, although they have made up the majority of the posts there so far.
Have a good evening,
--Bitterhand (talk) 00:35, August 7, 2019 (UTC)
why you be mean to me?
you insulted my creation
Hi, HiddenVale. I recently realized that I haven't taken care of the LotR wiki's Twitter page in a while. I'm sorry about that. I really should have kept it up, especially since I said I would. I've been occupied with a lot of stuff in the real world among other things. If you'd like, though, I can pick it up again, and make a post every week.
Infobox and discussions
I noticed when updating the articles for the three books of the trilogy that Infobox Book wasn't behaving properly when leaving fields blank; I took a look at it and was able to fix it, as well as update it to the new markup formatting (Draft). Just wanted to run it by you before I approved it to replace the old template as I'm not sure how difficult it is to revert.
Also, hopefully it won't be an issue, but the user you blocked earlier today left some spam in the discussions early this morning; I deleted the offending posts, but I'm not sure if blocking users from the wiki also blocks them from commenting there. I evidently don't have the option to ban people simply as a moderator, or I would have done it myself.
Have a good afternoon,
--Bitterhand (talk) 19:59, September 17, 2019 (UTC)
I am going to start writing a summary of the letters in my own words. Not copied from any website and not a full version of the letter. I will probably start this tommorow.
Do you think that the "directional" articles (i.e. North, Northeast, Southeast, etc.) would be candidates for deletion? Seems pretty self-explanatory to me. Also, just a reference to the above message about the book infobox in case you missed it.
Have a great day,
--Bitterhand (talk) 17:45, October 1, 2019 (UTC)
Deleting a page?
Hello HiddenVale, I think that someone just wrote a page called Why Samwise Gamgee is the Real Hero of Middle-Earth. I'm not sure if that is a proper subject for a page. Would it be a candidate for deletion? Na lû e-govaded 'wîn, ArwenUdomiel (talk) 21:43, October 7, 2019 (UTC)
On Deleted article
Remember Glaurung's attack on Beleriand or Glaurung's attack on the Beleriand. I've agreed with most of your deletions so far but I believe you should have at least consulted me on this one article. It is not just because I wrote it and want it to be preserved just for that reason alone, it is because I believe it to be a legitimate in-universe historical battle or event. I may not be mentioned by name but it is fully described in the Quenta Silmarillion as a part of the Noldor's war with Melkor, the life and history of the villain Glaurung, the Siege of Angband, and the long peace before the Dagor Bragollach. If not by named article, then much of the text alone is valid and worthy to be added to the Glaurung article. It is for this reason that I may revive it. I'd like for us to work something out on this as two admins who can both delete or un-delete things here.--DarkLantern (talk) 06:10, October 11, 2019 (UTC)
Long time no see. over a year I was on this wiki. I wanted to ask, do you think its ok if I went through all the forum pages and added some tag like a historial template where It says its old stuff? It would look something like this. MechQueste 00:12, October 16, 2019 (UTC)
Hey, just wanted to bring up a few things I've noticed recently.
1. I think the following articles are quite deletable if you'd like to take a look: The Rangers of Gondor, Ruffian Leader, FA 214, FO 57, and Hirwin (mistake redirect). There are some images in the deletion category that probably warrant removal at some point as well.
2. What do you think about semi-protecting Balin, Andúril, Narsil and/or Hobbits? For one reason or another it seems like these pages are vandalized more frequently than others. Also, even though it hasn't been a problem yet, it occurred to me that it would be quite easy for someone to cause trouble by renaming our major articles (Gandalf, Frodo, etc.).
4. I addressed some other topics in my most recent email, but I'm afraid it may have gotten lost between here and there or sent to the wrong address somehow. Disregard if you received it.
Hope everything's going well; have a great day!
--Bitterhand (talk) 15:18, November 5, 2019 (UTC)
Thanks for deleting the Rangers of Gondor page. Glad someone confirmed that it was unnecessary and that it needed to go.
Small question, are there any pages that need work on ? Happy to work on small 'project'.
You're welcome. Thanks for your suggestion. Found the Dwarves of Erebor, so I will be working on that.
Hope you have a great day!
Re: Wiki Work
Ah, yes. I was wondering what I forgot to change on the page. Thanks for pointing that out. I will fix that immediately.
Hello HiddenVale! I added citations to the Beleriand page and the information for the etymology section can be found if you look up Beleriand in the index to The Silmarillion. I looked through the book for the same information inside of a chapter and I could not find it. The LOTR:References Guide doesn't have anything about citing indexes. Is there anyway that I could cite the index? Thanks! ArwenUdomiel (talk) 00:59, November 22, 2019 (UTC)
Table of Contents
Hello! I've noticed that on some pages you add the magic word NOTOC. Should this be added on every page or only some pages? If so what pages should this be added on? Thanks! ArwenUdomiel (talk) 01:00, December 22, 2019 (UTC)
- Thank you! That makes perfect sense!
- Do you know why a table of contents does not appear on this talk page? talk2ty 14:32, February 18, 2020 (UTC)
Middle-earth series actors
Do you think it would be opportune to start creating articles for the main cast of Amazon's series, now that they've been officially announced? I'll get started on that if so.
As a relatively minor side note, 'Mirabella Took' in Template:Line of Brandybucks is a redlink; looks like it should link to the updated page title Mirabella (Took) Brandybuck. The template is admin-protected, else I'd take care of it myself. By the same token "the Forums" in Template:Welc1 appears to still link to the deleted Index.
A belated Happy New Year to you!
--Bitterhand (talk) 20:30, January 16, 2020 (UTC)
Thanks for the welcome message on my talk page. I have a question about the "Babel" and Lore Templates that are mentioned. I wasn't sure what a Babel Template is, so I clicked the link, and it took me to Fandom's main page. Is that an error? And if not, what is a Babel Template?
Also, this is kind of minute, but the Lord Template page has different levels of knowledge on the world of Middle-earth based on how many times one has seen/read the movies/books. I have trouble deciding which category I should be in, because I've only read the books and seen the movies once, but I have been well exposed to the world of Middle-earth (through reading articles, taking quizzes, watching film clips, etc.) and I consider myself to have a pretty good knowledge of Middle-earth (but what do I know? Maybe compared to other fans I'm on the ignorant side...). Is there, er, any other way to decide which level of lore I belong in?
Thanks in advance.
Hello! Noticed recently that our article Deephole appears to have been created out of a misreading of the word "Deephallow" which appears on this map (the last several letters are obscured by the dot denoting the place's location if you look closely). Can't find any reference to a "Deephole" elsewhere, and we already have an article for Deephallow.
In addition, would you look at undeleting the North Stair article? Obviously it was poorly written the first go-around, but I had some ideas to overhaul it/cut out the fat, so to speak, since it is mentioned twice in FotR.
Have a great week,
--Bitterhand (talk) 21:26, January 26, 2020 (UTC)
Anna Lee drawing
Hello HiddenVale! Can you rename the file 7cc601c5b2dadbe05429898071e7a77a.jpg to File:Arwen by Anna Lee.jpg since only admins can remane files. Thank you! ArwenUdomiel (talk) 21:02, January 28, 2020 (UTC)
Just noticed that the vandalism to the One Ring article was perpetrated by three different users; RAmCow88, Edwil777, and IKSM in seemingly a coordinated effort, due to the edits happening at the same time and the common... nature... of their vandalism. Just wanted to give you a heads-up in case they try something else; they uploaded some rather distasteful images as well.
Have a great weekend!
--Bitterhand (talk) 01:28, February 7, 2020 (UTC)
Since the invisibility article was unnecessary, would some or all of the articles including Darkness, Immortality, Primogeniture, and Sapience fall into that same category? The latter two, at least, would seem to be excludable according to Content Parameters.
--Bitterhand (talk) 01:51, February 18, 2020 (UTC)
Sorry, I didn't know we didn't do overview articles. I guess because it seems like it isn't just the One Ring which does invisibility but also the rings of men. Seems like when you become a Ring Wraith your body is permanently invisible but Sauron can still lend out the Rings of Men which can turn equipment (like cloak/weapon) invisible, but apparently he stopped doing that later because he wanted to make sure he could control the Wraiths once the One Ring fell into the hands of a strong-willed adventurer. talk2ty 14:30, February 18, 2020 (UTC)
Blog vs. Forum
I have a question. On this wiki, what is the difference between the blog and the forum? Thanks.
Content of Infoboxes
Hello HiddenVale! I have noticed that you've been deleting informatin from Infoboxes. What content is supposed to be in the Infoboxes? Is uncertain information supposed to be deleted? Thanks! ArwenUdomiel (talk) 22:51, February 23, 2020 (UTC)
Hi! I just want to notify you that the interwiki to go to "The One Wiki to Rule Them All" do not work. This happens when switching from any language section to yours. - Lat-ras (talk) 01:46, February 24, 2020 (UTC)
Fandom update on UCP
Hello! I hope things have been going well here.
I'm visiting share a new blog post from Fandom that includes more context on the Unified Community Platform (UCP for short) and some details on how the MediaWiki upgrade and feature changes will be happening in the next few months.
Hello! Just wanted to let you know I noticed that User:Exodius1980, who has vandalized multiple pages recently, has evidently created User:Darklanter (among others) to attempt the same edits after I reverted them. Not sure what options are available to prevent this sort of thing; perhaps we might semi-protect these articles?
From a different angle, would it be inopportune if I volunteer to become an admin at this point? I know Darklantern and yourself aren't able to monitor everything at all times, and I could certainly provide another pair of eyes as far as stamping out vandalism goes. In any case, I'm willing to help however needed. Thanks!
--Bitterhand (talk) 18:03, March 26, 2020 (UTC)
My university transitioned to online classes-only as well; happily, due to the nature of my courses this semester, I have quite a bit of free time for now. Other than a touch of cabin fever, doing well! Will you be graduating soon, then? I'll be starting my senior year in the fall... certainly understand how hectic school can be.
Perhaps (likely) I'm overanalyzing things; my thought was that I could in some sense fill Darkchylde's role as an admin, since she appears to no longer be a part of the community here. Again, just my ramblings; I'll be happy to help with any projects you have in mind! Also, let me know if anything I do with the templates or policy pages gets out of line, I know I've done a bit of work with those recently.
Glad to hear you're doing well, these are strange times indeed.
--Bitterhand (talk) 20:42, March 26, 2020 (UTC)
Just remembered some articles I've come across that can probably be deleted: Troll's bane, The Two Towers (1983 film), Template:OOU, and Template:Spoilers, and this category. Explanations should be at each location.
Glad you liked the new protection notice, btw. :)
--Bitterhand (talk) 03:18, April 1, 2020 (UTC)